if the gorgs had their own singing part in the theme... [Archive]

RedPiggy

01-09-2009, 11:22 AM

Don't get me wrong, I laughed at the "thump your cares away" bit. However, the goal of the audience is to see that Junior's thumping is more of the "carried-away curious kid" thing than his Pa's "I'll get them varmints" thing. The problem with mentioning thumping in the lyrics is that it gives off a bad first impression.

RedPiggy

01-09-2009, 11:48 AM

And little boys don't understand that keeping that frog in their pocket is harmful. That's why I said his issue is more the "carried-away curious kid" thing. However, bragging about thumping in the lyrics would give off the first impression that the Gorgs are evil, sadistic, cruel monsters. Wording it my way shows they're not all that thrilled with Fraggles, but they aren't bragging about killing them, either.

RedPiggy

01-09-2009, 11:57 AM

I'm must not be getting it. We're agreeing.

Quesal

01-09-2009, 05:42 PM

Wow! I mention "thump"
and look at the conversation I sparked up! LOL

Quesal

01-09-2009, 05:58 PM

And they say conversation is a dying art!

RedPiggy

01-09-2009, 08:03 PM

This is my impression of the conversation:

1. I liked "thump your cares away" (really, I did).

2. I thought it made the Gorgs sound like sadistic brutes and, while funny, isn't entirely accurate and gives a bad first impression. It makes it sound like their entire world revolves around thumping, when in reality they focus on deterring Fraggles from their garden. In terms of tone, there's a difference.

3. I chose a lyric that involved a more complete "gist" of Gorgs (and added the word Trash because poor Marjory gets left out of the theme song).

4. I explain my rationale.

5. Wwfpooh pretty much says the same thing as I did, namely that Junior's reason differs from his parents'.

6. I feel the implication is that I'm missing the point of thumping, even though I mentioned it specifically.

7. We both continue to agree (though it sounds like a disagreement) ... and I can't figure out why we seem to be having an agreeable disagreement. I get thoroughly confused.

8. I have a suspicion wwfpooh is trying to justify the thumping lyric as a part of Gorgish characterization. I now ask wwfpooh if that is the case.

9. I patiently wait to see if I'm on target.
:D

Quesal

01-09-2009, 09:28 PM

Good point

Redsonga

01-09-2009, 11:39 PM

The weird thing is from all those years ago when I first saw the show when I was 12..I don't have any memories if the 'thumping' part of the gorgs at all, just the songs and dances :3

unclematt

01-10-2009, 12:00 AM

This is deep I am going to stay clear of this entire thread.

Redsonga

01-10-2009, 12:13 AM

I don't see anything scary about it O.o You can post here...I was asking everyone :)

unclematt

01-10-2009, 01:14 AM

Fraggles for another day,down at Kissing Rock! Why cant I right this song?

Quesal

01-10-2009, 01:40 AM

I don't remember the term thump either. I remember seeing episodes when I was younger, but my clearest memory of anything Fraggle Rock like was the Fraggle Rock Characters' appearances in A Muppet Family Christmas.

unclematt

01-10-2009, 01:55 AM

Catch a Fraggle today, Planting for another day, Ooops, he got away, Down at Kissing Rock

RedPiggy

01-10-2009, 07:25 AM

Catch a Fraggle today, Planting for another day, Ooops, he got away, Down at Kissing Rock
ROFL! That was great!

Redsonga

01-10-2009, 07:47 AM

Catch a Fraggle today, Planting for another day, Ooops, he got away, Down at Kissing Rock

I can so see that being real:). Although, I think it would still be "down in Fraggle Rock" since the chorus is always sung by the fraggles..actually, I can see it being sung by Gobo as he falls back down to the pond "Down in fraaaggle *splash* rock!"

RedPiggy

01-10-2009, 09:06 AM

Yeah, Gobo singing as he falls down the well would be EPIC. LOL...

Quesal

01-10-2009, 10:23 AM

Catch a Fraggle today, Planting for another day, Ooops, he got away, Down at Kissing Rock

GENIUS! GENIUS!

unclematt

01-11-2009, 11:35 PM

I am so glad you all like it

Quesal

01-12-2009, 01:18 AM

Well, it was right on the money with the Gorg's way of thinking.

And that's not easy for many people to do...is it?

unclematt

01-12-2009, 01:25 AM

I dont know if thats a compliment or not?

Redsonga

01-12-2009, 10:20 AM

*shrugs* It depends on which view of the Gorgs one takes. One second, they could appear as violent attackers to the Fraggles (Junior in the earlier episodes) and the next, they could befriend the very creatures they were trying to thump (Junior in the later episodes).

I really don't see it as lasting as a perfect peace forever...to them I think it is like having mice, you forget about them if you have bigger troubles and you might even be 'nice' to them by letting them run wild, but I don't see gorgs as having long memories about things that aren't about gorgs. They are like many humans, self important and forgetful about rights when it doesn't suit them (expect for Junior, who I think would stay nice to them). In my version of FR they go from plain thumbing to doing experiments on them and charting them like animals on a nature show because Jr's wife sees it as more 'civilized' and humane.

Quesal

01-12-2009, 10:33 AM

I dont know if thats a compliment or not?

I meant it as a compliment.

RedPiggy

01-12-2009, 11:45 AM

*shrugs* It depends on which view of the Gorgs one takes. One second, they could appear as violent attackers to the Fraggles (Junior in the earlier episodes) and the next, they could befriend the very creatures they were trying to thump (Junior in the later episodes).
From the action during the opening, it's very clear he's just an overexuberant critter collector, like many boys (and me, but I'm a tomboy :D).

I think the change is less about Junior than it is the FRAGGLES' perception of Junior. Look at Mokey's Funeral. Junior never wanted to kill anyone. His parents might have (though Ma is more inconsistent than Pa), but Junior was always just a thoughtless kid when it came to other creatures.

It's the FRAGGLES, beginning with Mokey, I think, who start to see the Gorgs, especially Junior, in a different light as the episodes wear on. THEY were the ones who feared getting killed. How many Fraggles have been killed by Gorgs? Most outrun them, and the ones that DO get "thumped" just end up in bandages later.

Redsonga

01-12-2009, 12:05 PM

Think of this, if you were thumped but could still walk would you wait around to see what comes next past the point of bandages? I know I wouldn't...
*whispers* I really think the gorgs use to eat them (and might, still)..but then I think many things still do..Fraggles seem like one of those things, like rabbits, that if left to themselves would have a lot more than 10,000 + of their kind in the whole world ;) *eyes Boober*...

RedPiggy

01-12-2009, 12:52 PM

Think of this, if you were thumped but could still walk would you wait around to see what comes next past the point of bandages? I know I wouldn't...
If you were too slow to avoid getting thumped, how does having a broken leg make you faster? :D
*whispers* I really think the gorgs use to eat them (and might, still)..but then I think many things still do..Fraggles seem like one of those things, like rabbits, that if left to themselves would have a lot more than 10,000 + of their kind in the whole world *eyes Boober*...
Out of EVERY dish we've ever heard of that the Gorgs make ... at what point do we ever hear "meat"? The most I've seen is including eggs (since Junior wanted one and I don't think you can make cakes and stuff without them). Gorgs may be omnivores, but we only see them eat vegetarian stuff. Have we EVER seen them chomp down on some meat?

Just because the Fraggles ASSUMED Gorgs ate Fraggles doesn't mean they DO.

Redsonga

01-12-2009, 01:36 PM

If you were too slow to avoid getting thumped, how does having a broken leg make you faster? :D
It doesn't mean you still couldn't get away if you were smart enough ;). And like I said if I could in anyway, I would rather than see what might happen next...

Out of EVERY dish we've ever heard of that the Gorgs make ... at what point do we ever hear "meat"? The most I've seen is including eggs (since Junior wanted one and I don't think you can make cakes and stuff without them). Gorgs may be omnivores, but we only see them eat vegetarian stuff. Have we EVER seen them chomp down on some meat?
Just because they never talk about it in the show doesn't mean it couldn't have been a part of their diet we just never saw. I mean someone who always misses the night a silly creature family eats fish might think we never eat it when we do :3. And even if we eat fish we don't make a daily habit of talking about it (at least all the people I know don't...)

*Always found it funny that the 'eggs' fraggles cook with are actually gourds*

Just because the Fraggles ASSUMED Gorgs ate Fraggles doesn't mean they DO.
And it doesn't mean they don't, or didn't in the past..Stewed fraggles tell no tales:eek:

RedPiggy

01-12-2009, 02:12 PM

Just because they never talk about it in the show doesn't mean it couldn't have been a part of their diet we just never saw. I mean someone who always misses the night a silly creature family eats fish might think we never eat it when we do :3. And even if we eat fish we don't make a daily habit of talking about it (at least all the people I know don't...)
I see what you're saying, but from my perspective, there's nothing canon outside of Fraggle fears that Gorgs eat them. If we're going to say that Gorgs are cruel (which, to me, is what mentioning "thumping" in the theme song would suggest), then we need to back that up with more than Fragglish rumor. The fact remains that the theme of the show is learning to understand one another, we never see the Gorgs eat anything even remotely animal, and characters who get "thumped" just don't disappear, they just get hurt. The Fraggles assume WE'RE to be feared, too. But in OUR case, I could see how they would think that, given that we're notorious meat-eaters and many pride themselves on it.

Redsonga

01-12-2009, 02:34 PM

and characters who get "thumped" just don't disappear, they just get hurt.
The ones we see, there could be ones we didn't that never returned. The way I see it rumors always start from some truth and the understanding that the series gives between fraggles and gorgs is only between that family of gorgs and that group of fraggles, who knows what the rest might do and how long it will all last...I'm just thinking of it in terms of a bigger world than we are shown, not because I think the gorgs are bloodthirsty or anything...I mean I caught frogs when I was little and would never think of eating them, but some cultures do...I'm not saying fraggles are frogs but maybe many smaller creatures in their world can talk and have cultures and so it is all the same to bigger things like gorgs :sympathy:

unclematt

01-12-2009, 03:12 PM

I meant it as a compliment.

Then I shall take it as one.

heralde

01-12-2009, 10:11 PM

Hmm...I mean Junior did have his own song where we talked about catching and kicking the Fraggles. But I think I agree that for the theme song, it needed to be a bit more ambiguous so they didn't appear like out and out bad guys.

I think people can have their own interpretations (that's what fanfics are for, hehe), but I personally don't think the Gorgs ate the Fraggles. Pa and Ma seem more disgusted by them than anything, like they're rodents. And they don't act disapointed when Junior fails to catch them, like they're missing a meal. They're more annoyed that Junior's going through all the trouble.

heralde

01-12-2009, 10:15 PM

But yet, oddly, they'd be at a crossroads in that either they want the Fraggles caught or they don't want them caught.

You know, I know not everyone likes Robot Chicken, lol. But I'm reminded of one skit where they parodied the Smurfs and they showed Gargamel (the Smurf villian of course) being asked why he hated the Smurfs. And he says something like "Actually my motivations were never entirely clear." Lol, which is very true. ;)

heralde

01-12-2009, 10:19 PM

Not really. In some instances, Gargamel has said that he and his cat would want to cook and eat the Smurfs for whatever bizzare reason.

Oh yeah, but then another time it might be different, as with the Gorgs.

Redsonga

01-12-2009, 10:22 PM

You know, I know not everyone likes Robot Chicken, lol. But I'm reminded of one skit where they parodied the Smurfs and they showed Gargamel (the Smurf villian of course) being asked why he hated the Smurfs. And he says something like "Actually my motivations were never entirely clear." Lol, which is very true. ;)

But in that case Gargamel did want to eat them even though he hated them (which makes sense since it looked like the middle ages and he was very poor, or at least had a castle but not any/much food).

Anyway I am asking this question because I was thinking of putting a longer verison of the theme in my fanfic:coy:...and rather than get something so beloved wrong I was thinking of putting in a gorg part most of us could agree on..of course I could still just write my own version to...but there is no harm in asking :)

RedPiggy

01-13-2009, 06:59 AM

Speaking of Gorgs...I wonder if they'll have a bit in the new film?
I hope so, but it kinda depends on the Fragglish plot.

unclematt

01-18-2009, 03:10 AM

RedPiggy

01-18-2009, 07:53 AM

I just don't see the Gorgs being in the film just because of what I have heard of the plot line. I think it is going to focus mainly on the Fraggles in Outer Space and not so much in the actual Rock which would then in turn make it hard to incorporate the Gorgs
I must be thinking of Redsonga's fic too much. I dreamed last night that we were watching G4 and they started showing a preview for Fraggle Rock, with Fraggles streaming out of sewer drains (at first I thought it was another TMNT flick), and Junior was walking down Broadway in NYC at night, lost. :)

I was SO excited to see a preview ... and bummed because they forgot to mention the release date. :(

Redsonga

01-18-2009, 11:13 AM

I must be thinking of Redsonga's fic too much. I dreamed last night that we were watching G4 and they started showing a preview for Fraggle Rock, with Fraggles streaming out of sewer drains (at first I thought it was another TMNT flick), and Junior was walking down Broadway in NYC at night, lost.

I was SO excited to see a preview ... and bummed because they forgot to mention the release date.

*hee* Well my fic is just how I think it would work best in a perfect world..and in one they won't leave out half of the FR world just because they were going to Outer Space:coy:. I can think of a dozen ways to put the gorgs in that makes sense:o.