Caped Crusader: New Batman Film Rumors

[frogboy4]

I felt like a new thread should be devoted to this since the topic was changing from the Dark Knight to Nolan's third installment of his Batman films. The working title appears to be "The Caped Crusader".

First, it appears director Christopher Nolan is back. There were concerns that he would storm out leaving only a cartoon dust could in his wake if Warner Brothers and DC continued plans for a separate Justice League movie that would feature a different Batman along side Superman, Wonder Woman and the Flash etc. That film appears to be gone (at least for the time being) thank frog! :)

:zany: Second, it's no secret that Phillip Seymour Hoffman's name was passed around for a possible Penguin in both the Dark Knight and now this future film. Most directors don't like the Penguin or take him seriously as a menacing threat. Take this analogy: Bruce Wayne is to the Penguin in Batman as Arnold Schwarzenegger was to Danny DeVito in the movie Twins. It's no surprise DeVito later played the character in Burton's film. The Penguin is a fun-house mirror of Bruce Wayne/Batman and bitter for it. Nolan and Hoffman's Penguin portrayal was rumored to be everything from a Russian weapons trader, assassin for hire or a spy. There was never much good buzz around this idea so it appears to be just as dead as the JLA movie. It is not likely.

Third, we know Catwoman is a very viable candidate for the next Batman film. Selena Kyle aka Catwoman really boils down to an agile jewel thief and nimble flirtatious foe for Batman. She easily translates into Nolan's real-world scenario. Halle Berry's performance and Catwoman film was just not right for countless reasons. So many factors failed her Berry and she ultimately failed as Catwoman. That's nicest way I can say it. Michelle Pfeiffer won the role over other contenders like Madonna, Sean Young and Cher. Pfeiffer put in a fantastic performance and I wish Burton had continued with a solo film for her, but it didn't pan out. However, Cher's patience may have paid off! She's rumored for Nolan's vision of an aging "cougar" take on Catwoman. I don't quite know what to feel about that.

;) Fourth, formalities aside it appears Johnny Depp has been chosen for the Riddler. This is probably the best news. I wonder how his pal Tim Burton would feel about it (or even Nolan's Batman films in general). Jim Carrey played the Riddler as if he'd lost out on playing the Joker. Carrey's take bubbled over with more energy than the character requires. The Riddler is more of an accountant/technician type who terrorizes victims with intricate puzzles instead of retired pop culture references. One could speculate Nolan's vision of the character would be akin to the villainous tactics in the Saw movies (but without that needless level of gore, of course). I can see Depp finding the core of this reserved nerd and reinventing the Riddler the way Ledger has with the Joker. Depp would lend a dramatic credibility to the role rather than the strutting and posing of Riddlers past. I really hope this happens.

Finally, filming of the new The Caped Crusader is slated to begin in Vancouver early next year! That could mean a possible release date of 2010.

Source cited: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/celebritynews/2612613/Cher-to-play-Catwoman-in-next-Batman-film.html

[wwfpooh]

I wonder how many films The Bat will have?

[Drtooth]

Fourth, formalities aside it appears Johnny Depp has been chosen for the Riddler. This is probably the best news. I wonder how his pal Tim Burton would feel about it (or even Nolan's Batman films in general). Jim Carrey played the Riddler as if he'd lost out on playing the Joker. Carrey's take bubbled over with more energy than the character requires. The Riddler is more of an accountant/technician type who terrorizes victims with intricate puzzles instead of retired pop culture references. One could speculate Nolan's vision of the character would be akin to the villainous tactics in the Saw movies (but without that needless level of gore, of course). I can see Depp finding the core of this reserved nerd and reinventing the Riddler the way Ledger has with the Joker. Depp would lend a dramatic credibility to the role rather than the strutting and posing of Riddlers past. I really hope this happens.

It is quite clear that Jim Carrey was trying to play the Riddler as Frank Gorshin. I have to admit, after a while I started to like what they were trying to do with The Riddler in The Batman (in a Marilyn Manson style get up :insatiable: no less), and I wouldn't be surprised if the Riddler here has a similar tone.

I do think the title "caped Crusader" sounds too corny. Something like "Batman: enemy of the People" or something would fit much better (since... SPOILER.... he because the "villain" at the end of the movie to protect Harvey Dent's name).

[wwfpooh]

(since... SPOILER.... he becaame the "villain" at the end of the movie to protect Harvey Dent's name)But he wasn't the villain, Harvey's Two-Face half was. And FYI, Jim Gordon put it best in that Batman is the hero Gotham deserves, but not the one it currently needs.

[frogboy4]

It is quite clear that Jim Carrey was trying to play the Riddler as Frank Gorshin. I have to admit, after a while I started to like what they were trying to do with The Riddler in The Batman (in a Marilyn Manson style get up :insatiable: no less), and I wouldn't be surprised if the Riddler here has a similar tone.

I do think the title "caped Crusader" sounds too corny. Something like "Batman: enemy of the People" or something would fit much better (since... SPOILER.... he because the "villain" at the end of the movie to protect Harvey Dent's name).

Judging from what Nolan has done in the other two films; I don’t think Nolan’s take on the Riddler would go with anything like Frank Gorshin or Jim Carrey. It’s clear he doesn’t enjoy those tellings of Batman. He seems to go to a characters' comic book origin and find an updated real-world solution for it. I can see some Marilyn Manson sort of make-up. Who would Edward Nygma represent today or in Nolan’s telling? A disenfranchised computer-programmer-dot-commer-gone-bust?

I’m still freaking over Cher as Catwoman. I can think of other mature women who would better fit the cougar image and still have some “sex-appeal” like Annette Benning or Sean Young (who once wore a cat costume and stalked Tim Burton after not getting the role from him). Heck, if Madonna could act I’d cast her over Cher. I just don’t know about the Cher thing? She is a talented woman.

[wwfpooh]

Who would Edward Nygma represent today or in Nolan’s telling? A disenfranchised computer-programmer-dot-commer-gone-bust?And when he tries to get funds from Bruce, Bruce turns him down, driving him mad.

[Drtooth]

Judging from what Nolan has done in the other two films; I don’t think Nolan’s take on the Riddler would go with anything like Frank Gorshin or Jim Carrey. It’s clear he doesn’t enjoy those tellings of Batman. He seems to go to a characters' comic book origin and find an updated real-world solution for it. I can see some Marilyn Manson sort of make-up. Who would Edward Nygma represent today or in Nolan’s telling? A disenfranchised computer-programmer-dot-commer-gone-bust?

Yeah... something similar to this (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/76/TheBatmanRiddler.jpg). I have to say they handled him well in The Batman just before the series ended. There was a great episode about how he was cheated out of the acclaim of an invention that could have changed lives, and becoming a villain out of revenge. Something similar to that is what I see.

But he wasn't the villain, Harvey's Two-Face half was. And FYI, Jim Gordon put it best in that Batman is the hero Gotham deserves, but not the one it currently needs.

At the end of the film, Batman voulenteers to be the bad guy so they won't tarnish the life of Harvey Dent, who more people thought was a hero than Batman.

[wwfpooh]

At the end of the film, Batman voulenteers to be the bad guy so they won't tarnish the life of Harvey Dent,And watch Harvey come back again, like most villains in comics do after they "die".

who more people thought was a hero than Batman.If only 'cause the denizens of Gotham are sort of...no offense to any New Yorkers...stupid and ignorant.

[frogboy4]

Yeah... something similar to this (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/76/TheBatmanRiddler.jpg). I have to say they handled him well in The Batman just before the series ended. There was a great episode about how he was cheated out of the acclaim of an invention that could have changed lives, and becoming a villain out of revenge. Something similar to that is what I see.

I always think that The Batman version of the Riddler resembles me in my misspent glam-goth days. Not kidding about that. I really like that version. You do know that Robert Englund aka Freddy Krueger) voiced that character on the program? Interesting choice. While I can’t see any character in such an outfit for Nolan Batman franchise, I can imagine some of the makeup and demeanor. I am sure Depp would bring some unique quirks to the role as well. He really is the only actor that can follow Heath Ledger’s performance.

After reading around the web a bit I have noted others’ dismissive perception of the Telegraph article I cited and that publication in general. Good thing I remembered to put the word “rumors” in the thread title. Sometimes directors like to mislead unwitting publications to throw them off the true story.

I do like the title – The Caped Crusader. Gotham Crusader is also good, but doesn’t have the same snap.

[The 11th UrRu]

While I am as excited as any for the next "Nolan worked" Batman, that Telegraph article is completey ridiculous. Goyer has to write a script first, and that comes after Nolan and his crew signs on, which comes after they sit down and talk about a deal... absolutely nothings happenned yet, Cher as Catwoman... this is so ridiculous, I cant find words to describe how outragous that is .

Ive never seen the movie, only the trailer (not much for horror movies over here), but if they do choose the riddler as a villian I think he might end up being very similar to the villian in the "Saw" movie series...

[Drtooth]

And watch Harvey come back again, like most villains in comics do after they "die".


He is indeed dead. They are NOT going to bring him back.

[Baby Gonzo]

I just don't think I could really fall for another Batman movie. The Joker is the ultimate Batman villain. He always has been, at least as far as my opinion (mainly drawing from the animated series from back in the 90s) goes. Sure, other villains were interesting, but the Joker has always been the unbeatable one. Plus, I would have loved to see a live action movie feature Harley Quinn. Yes, that would probably be highly unlikely considering she was created for Batman: The Animated Series, but I think she could be really interesting to see in a live action film.


Ugh. Sorry. This post turned into a dumb pining for the animated series. I might give another Batman movie a chance, even sans Joker if it seems like a good movie.

[frogboy4]

There's much fan speculation surrounding a new Batman film. Rotten Tomatoes provided the link to the article so I respected it a little more than if I'd stumbled on it myself. It has performed so well that there will be another one and it appears that WB didn't need much wooing to get Nolan back. However, Nolan did say that third films in trilogies are often the weakest.

The reason why I believe multiple Batman films will work is due to the endless rogue’s gallery of villains. He has the best. The Joker's my favorite too, but there are so many other avenues to explore. I think Nolan can find the right hook for this new film. There is a lot left to work with. Even after TDK, I felt that there was so much more to do. There's at least a third act to this Batman and I'm curious to see what's next even if it take a few years.

[Teheheman]

Actually, from what I heard, the last scene in the Batman movie DOES feature Harley Quinn, so I think that there COULD be an appearance. I think that she could be a good villain for him. Personally, I think that the Riddler could be just like the Joker was in this last one. I like the Catwoman as a "cougar" kind of character. Although, Brooke Shields or Cher, or maybe even Felicity Huffman might be good in that role. Maybe Poison Ivy can be another good character with Marsha Cross playing the role. I'd also like to see the Riddler played by Johnny Depp, considering that he creeped me out as Willy Wonka, if he could bring that kind of creepiness into it, then I'd say go for it. Although, if you're going to have a creepy Riddler, maybe Robin Williams, but then again, he'd be too cartoonish. I'd also try and make a new villain. Somebody that nobody's heard of before. Maybe make a movie for Batgirl. Reese Witherspoon, Drew Barrymore, or somebody could play Batgirl. But that's my thoughts on it, I'm not a comic book
geek ya know?

Daniel

[mrsieve]

How about the chance of Black Mask? It continues the whole mob storyline from the first too. Where is Harley Quinn seen at the end of the movie?

[Teheheman]

My friend told me that when you see the Joker in either the jail or hospital or something at the end of the movie, there's a little conversation at the end of the movie between the Joker and Harley Quinn. I dunno, I haven't seen it so it could've been after the credits.

Daniel

[Beauregard]

Well...for people thinking they couldn't fall for a third movie, the fact is, without a third movie the series doesn't complete. There's something missing. We are left open-ended and unsatisfied. It's been designed as a trilogy, and a trilogy it will have to be. As for the villian...I'd still like to see a "real-life" (aka. non magic powered) version of Poison Ivy. I think it would be interesting to see the contrast between how she wants the world to be (nature) and Gotham. Of course it could end up being a "extremist green-peace movie" but I think that would definatly be interesting.

[Teheheman]

Actually, Poison Ivy could be a good villain for one of the new movies(and yes I know there is only talk of a 3rd, but really, who are we kidding? There will be more than 3) We're talking if Poison Ivy were re-written as an environmentalist who is WAY too into being one. You know the ones I'm talking about. The ones that take nature WAY too seriously? I know there's a name for those but I can't remember what it is.

Daniel

[Super Scooter]

Actually, Poison Ivy could be a good villain for one of the new movies(and yes I know there is only talk of a 3rd, but really, who are we kidding? There will be more than 3)

Supposedly, Christopher Nolan said he's only doing three. I'm sure Warner Brothers will make more than three, but that's all there will be to the Nolan series. So, the story he wants to tell with Batman will have to wrap up in the third one.

[wwfpooh]

He is indeed dead. They are NOT going to bring him back.Drat. That's twice--lol--my fav Bat villain's ended up dead.

[frogboy4]

Drat. That's twice--lol--my fav Bat villain's ended up dead.

Spoiler for anyone that missed The Dark Knight.


Harvey Dent's injuries were so dire that I doubt that he would have survived for long. He was running on adrenaline toward the end of the film. The opportunity for infection of any number of his open wounds was too high. His exposed eye alone could have killed him in Nolan's more realistic world. The studio and advertising did make it appear that he would be back and the third film would center on Two Face, but I think they were just trying to misdirect viewers for plans on continuing on with the Joker. Then Heath Ledger died and the plan changed, but Dent would still be dead. I still hope the character of the Joker lives on in the next film, but through tales that we only hear about and maybe a couple of near-misses with Batman too late to catch him. I think the ultimate tribute to Ledger's performance for his character to live on...but not seen.

Spoiler over.

I hope Depp is cast as the Riddler (or any other villain).

[Teheheman]

I think that the character can live on with Harley Quinn if they bring her character back in the new one.

Daniel

[wwfpooh]

I hope Depp is cast as the Riddler (or any other villain).Depp fan much? XD

[Super Scooter]

This was on IMDb about a possible Riddler origin:

"There is also speculation that the unnamed bank manager at the beginning of the movie (played by William Fichtner) may be Ed Nygma and may become the Riddler following the events of the film. The manager was last seen lying on the floor after being shot by the Joker, who tells him, "What doesn't kill you makes you stranger." This may foreshadow the manager's transformation into the Riddler or another villain. If his injuries are extensive enough, the bank manager may not be able to walk without the use of a cane. The Riddler is known for carrying a cane with a large question mark on the top end."

As much as I like Johnny Depp, and think he would be awesome as the Riddler, I love this idea! It doesn't quite work with the characters original backstory, but it's an interesting way to tie the two films together. I like it.

And, supposedly, Christopher Nolan laughed at the thought of Harley Quinn for the next one... though that would be interesting. Supposedly there's some left over footage of the Joker that could be integrated with the new film, perhaps as a way to introduce Harley Quinn. Who knows?

[wwfpooh]

It doesn't quite work with the characters original backstory,Not one of the Bat's villains in this triology has their true comic backstory, you know that, right?

[Super Scooter]

Not one of the Bat's villains in this triology has their true comic backstory, you know that, right?

That's not entirely accurate. The Joker HAS no backstory, same as in the film. Heath Ledger's performance of the Joker was based on the character from The Killing Joke. And Ra's al Ghul was very much like in the comics, aside from the whole "supernatural" aspect of the character.

[wwfpooh]

That's not entirely accurate. The Joker HAS no backstory, same as in the film. Heath Ledger's performance of the Joker was based on the character from The Killing Joke. And Ra's al Ghul was very much like in the comics, aside from the whole "supernatural" aspect of the character.Okay, sans two, most of the Bat's villains who starred in any Bat-related film didn't remain true to their comic origins.

[Teheheman]

I heard that in the latest movie, the fans of the comic knew which of the stories on how the Joker got his scars on his face where the makeup is, was true. As far as the Riddler was concerned, I like that idea. It would be a GREAT way to kind of tie things together.

Daniel

[ryhoyarbie]

I would take a guess, just a guess, that Nolan and company do not have a story already planned out for thr third movie, though I'm sure they have some ideas floating around.

Too early to say anything at this point.

[wwfpooh]

That's 'cause the movie is still being toyed at present.

[ryhoyarbie]

That's 'cause the movie is still being toyed at present.

Well according to the some of the people on this thread, there is already a story and The Riddler as been casted.

Like I said, I don't believe in those rumors. Too early.

[frogboy4]

Well according to the some of the people on this thread, there is already a story and The Riddler as been casted.

Like I said, I don't believe in those rumors. Too early.

I never claimed any information (even the article content) to be anything more than rumor (as also stated in the thread title. I still don't get the Cher angle or quite believe it. I know WB wants to push the project along. I don't think there could be a full script yet, but Nolan seems to have set quite a stage for future films that I am sure he has many ideas. I do wonder in this case if they will cast before pounding out a solid script. It does happen a lot. It's not like people wouldn't trust the team behind the last two films. There's been so much Depp buzz that it's reported as almost a lock now, but I'm not convinced. I still don't know what to believe except the third installment will likely be pretty good. Past indicators would say so.

[wwfpooh]

Past indicators would say loads of movies are good, but as was pointed out earlier, the third movie in a triology is often the weakest.

[Drtooth]

Spoiler for anyone that missed The Dark Knight.


Harvey Dent's injuries were so dire that I doubt that he would have survived for long. He was running on adrenaline toward the end of the film. The opportunity for infection of any number of his open wounds was too high. His exposed eye alone could have killed him in Nolan's more realistic world. The studio and advertising did make it appear that he would be back and the third film would center on Two Face, but I think they were just trying to misdirect viewers for plans on continuing on with the Joker. Then Heath Ledger died and the plan changed, but Dent would still be dead. I still hope the character of the Joker lives on in the next film, but through tales that we only hear about and maybe a couple of near-misses with Batman too late to catch him. I think the ultimate tribute to Ledger's performance for his character to live on...but not seen.



MORE SPOILER

The script even SAID that he lies in the ground twisted and dead. At one point a lot of fan speculation was hovering about that he was just playing possum, and he'd be in the next film. But the producers and writers jumped out pointing out that part of the screen play.

Which is a shame. They should have built it up for the next film.

[wwfpooh]

Which is a shame. They should have built it up for the next film.I agree. Harvey deserves more than a lackluster end.

[The 11th UrRu]

I agree. Harvey deserves more than a lackluster end.

I think his story arc was done, where could he have gone after this movie? I thought his rise and fall was executed perfectly...

As others have pointed out, its way too early... thery might have an idea of where they want to go, but the movie has not been written, and the riddler has certianly not been cast... its nice to speculate, but realistically were looking at 2011 at the earliest, and thats if Nolan doesnt direct The Exec or The Prisoner first.

[wwfpooh]

its nice to speculate, but realistically were looking at 2011 at the earliestGood point.

[Beauregard]

To be honest, I was very annoyed with Harvey Dent and his ridiculous CGI face. I think they should have done something more realistic with him. Why did his voice not even change with that great gash in his cheek? I was just thrown out of the movie everytime he went on screen after his face was changed.

[frogboy4]

I think his story arc was done, where could he have gone after this movie? I thought his rise and fall was executed perfectly...

As others have pointed out, its way too early... thery might have an idea of where they want to go, but the movie has not been written, and the riddler has certianly not been cast... its nice to speculate, but realistically were looking at 2011 at the earliest, and thats if Nolan doesnt direct The Exec or The Prisoner first.

It's no secret that 2009 will be a lighter year for films due to the writers' strike and that 2010 is likely to be overloaded with motion pictures. I would agree that 2011 seems most likely.

[Super Scooter]

I heard that Cher rumor on TV Guide channel AND on the radio yesterday. TV Guide said it was an online rumor, the radio announcer mixed up the story and said it was absolutely true.

I hope there's not too much truth behind the rumor. I just don't think I could buy into Cher as Catwoman... I mean, she's old enough to have played Catwoman on the original Batman TV show! It would be a very different Catwoman.

[wwfpooh]

Especially considering how The Cat & Bat have had an on-off relationship (or something akin to one) in the comics, both in their superhero/villain forms & in their charitable billionaire/animal rights activist forms.

[Drtooth]

It's no secret that 2009 will be a lighter year for films due to the writers' strike and that 2010 is likely to be overloaded with motion pictures. I would agree that 2011 seems most likely.

Light maybe... after all, there clearly are crappy films they can throw together... there has to be 5 more block buster films this year they can squeeze into 3 of those terrible parody movies.

[wwfpooh]

Hopefully, FR isn't one of them. I want it to be a blockbuster yes, but not if it turns into a mockery of what the franchise stands for.

[RedPiggy]

I'm surprised Nolan doesn't like Harley. This is a guy who had a whole scene with stupid Batman-wannabes playing dress-up and he can't even make her a Joker devotee?

I'd still like to see a duo or trio of femme fatales (Cat, Ivy, Harley). We haven't really addressed love/lust in a Nolan Bat-verse yet, and they'd be perfect in getting "boo-hoo" Bruce on the rebound.

:D

[Drtooth]

I'm surprised Nolan doesn't like Harley. This is a guy who had a whole scene with stupid Batman-wannabes playing dress-up and he can't even make her a Joker devotee?



Don't get me wrong. i like Harley too. I even loved how they worked her into the new The Batman series (even though she was only in 2 episodes before it got cancelled... thanks Warners!) but she was a character that appeared in The Animated Series that just caught on so well, she became part of the Batman comics. If they added her to the new movies, it would be fan service and nothing more. I can see her playing a more naive role, similar to Misa Misa in Death Note.. a crazed fangirl type, but nothing more.

If the Justice League movie would get made, she would do a lot better in that. If her and Mr. J were to get a breif cameo in that sort of a film, it would work. Something tells me, this wouldn't work here. Though, I would tend to think that a "Harley" character, a member of the Joker's gang that looks like her, but isn't mentioned by name and doesn't have any lines would kinda be a nice nod to fans.

Sort of like how Bebop and Rocksteady shouldn't be in the new Turtles cartoon, but it would have been great to have seen their human (pre-mutation) counterparts as members of the Purple Dragons. Again, not mentioned by name, and without lines.

[wwfpooh]

Sort of like how Bebop and Rocksteady shouldn't be in the new Turtles cartoon, but it would have been great to have seen their human (pre-mutation) counterparts as members of the Purple Dragons. Again, not mentioned by name, and without lines.And like how I feel Sally should cameo in the future Sonic series. Granted, it's based around the games, but let us not forget that Sally did cameo in games (Sonic Spinball & Sonic 16/Sonic Mars) & that her inspiration was derived from the very first Sonic game produced (which--incidentally, following Sonic's core development in Hawaii--debuted first in America, just as did the first-ever TV appearance of the blue blur [which would make him "a real American" (http://undead80.free.fr/Musiques/WWE/I%20am%20real%20american.wma), even though the Japanese then used him for the games in which he starred]).

[frogboy4]

Don't get me wrong. i like Harley too. I even loved how they worked her into the new The Batman series (even though she was only in 2 episodes before it got cancelled... thanks Warners!) but she was a character that appeared in The Animated Series that just caught on so well, she became part of the Batman comics. If they added her to the new movies, it would be fan service and nothing more. I can see her playing a more naive role, similar to Misa Misa in Death Note.. a crazed fangirl type, but nothing more.

If the Justice League movie would get made, she would do a lot better in that. If her and Mr. J were to get a breif cameo in that sort of a film, it would work. Something tells me, this wouldn't work here. Though, I would tend to think that a "Harley" character, a member of the Joker's gang that looks like her, but isn't mentioned by name and doesn't have any lines would kinda be a nice nod to fans.

Sort of like how Bebop and Rocksteady shouldn't be in the new Turtles cartoon, but it would have been great to have seen their human (pre-mutation) counterparts as members of the Purple Dragons. Again, not mentioned by name, and without lines.

Harley is in more than two episodes of The Batman, but not nearly enough. They brought her in to late. I have all 5 seasons on DVD. I don't consider it cancelled. Most series of that sort last up to 5 seasons and then they tie things up. It was clear to me that all of the last season was going for broke.

I'm not sure how I like the new lighter Batman: the Brave and the Bold (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman:_The_Brave_and_the_Bold)cartoon they're coming out with this fall. I don't see how it could live up to Batman the Animated Series (the gold standard) or The Batman (nearly perfect aside from jacking the Freeze origin). The new minds behind it report that Brave and Bold is designed to be less moody and more kid friendly. Ugh. We'll see.

[Drtooth]

Harley is in more than two episodes of The Batman, but not nearly enough. They brought her in to late. I have all 5 seasons on DVD. I don't consider it cancelled. Most series of that sort last up to 5 seasons and then they tie things up. It was clear to me that all of the last season was going for broke.

Personally, I think it could have and should have had a 6th season. I think they ended the series very well, doing away with Hugo Strange, but it seems like so much ground could have been covered in that season, instead of the Brave and the Bold practice run they had. You know, since most of the episodes were JLA team ups (which basically ammounted to "let's see who we can draw in The Batman style" for me). I think the show started out right, then they added Batgirl (which was a huge mistake, if you ask me...). I mean, Batgril pretty much came off as (if anyone has seen Jackie Chan Adventures) an older, Caucasian version of Jade (considering the same people worked on both shows, right down to the character desi9gners). I think season 4 was the turn around that made the show better (when they added Harley, etc.)

As for Brave and the Bold:

I'm not sure how I like the new lighter Batman: the Brave and the Bold (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman:_The_Brave_and_the_Bold)cartoon they're coming out with this fall. I don't see how it could live up to Batman the Animated Series (the gold standard) or The Batman (nearly perfect aside from jacking the Freeze origin). The new minds behind it report that Brave and Bold is designed to be less moody and more kid friendly. Ugh. We'll see.

I actually kinda find it refreshing they DON'T have to make this Batman series dark to coincide with any of the films. I mean, Batman TAS had a lot of the Tim Burton films in it, and The Batman was clearly inspired by Batman Begins (considering Lucious Fox became a character... plus the first season reflected the movie's tone a bit more than the other seasons).

Personally, I'm loving the art style behind it. And I think it brings back sort of a Super Friends type feel, but with more sophisticated comic book backings. Plus, they finally gave Plasticman a cartoon show... considering the hillarious Plastic Man pilot went unsold.

[The Count]

Hmmm... What if Harley got treated somewhat similarly in the next movie to her appearance/role in the Birds of Prey live series?

[wwfpooh]

I actually kinda find it refreshing they DON'T have to make this Batman series dark to coincide with any of the films.Perhaps Brave & Bold is returning to wear it all began...the campy, 60's style Batman known on TV & in the first film as being portrayed by West.

[Teheheman]

I'm sorry but there is only ONE Batman and his name is Adam West.

Daniel

[wwfpooh]

I'm sorry but there is only ONE Batman and his name is Adam West.

DanielBut I said that maybe Brave & Bold is paying homage to West's incarnation, considering its style and look.

[frogboy4]

Personally, I think it could have and should have had a 6th season. I think they ended the series very well, doing away with Hugo Strange, but it seems like so much ground could have been covered in that season, instead of the Brave and the Bold practice run they had. You know, since most of the episodes were JLA team ups (which basically ammounted to "let's see who we can draw in The Batman style" for me). I think the show started out right, then they added Batgirl (which was a huge mistake, if you ask me...). I mean, Batgril pretty much came off as (if anyone has seen Jackie Chan Adventures) an older, Caucasian version of Jade (considering the same people worked on both shows, right down to the character desi9gners). I think season 4 was the turn around that made the show better (when they added Harley, etc.)

As for Brave and the Bold:



I actually kinda find it refreshing they DON'T have to make this Batman series dark to coincide with any of the films. I mean, Batman TAS had a lot of the Tim Burton films in it, and The Batman was clearly inspired by Batman Begins (considering Lucious Fox became a character... plus the first season reflected the movie's tone a bit more than the other seasons).

Personally, I'm loving the art style behind it. And I think it brings back sort of a Super Friends type feel, but with more sophisticated comic book backings. Plus, they finally gave Plasticman a cartoon show... considering the hillarious Plastic Man pilot went unsold.

Lucious Fox was in Batman the Animated Series before Begins or The Batman. I don't like how this new Brave and Bold series has been pitched. It appears to me like the creators of it don't like other series. I guess it's all about personal taste in how we like to see our characters. I feel this could be backsliding into the old cheesier version of Batman. Then again, I abhor the Teen Titans overly anime look. It just doesn't appeal to me the way The Batman did. They were able to find a suitable balance. I too wish it had been given another season before this rounder-edged departure. It just is much less relatable to me.

I don't like this new style of the Brave and Bold. I find it ugly compared to others out there. They can do better. I have a feelig this might go the way of the Legion of Super Heroes (that I actually liked) that was axed. Again, I love animation - but the good stuff only. I never heard of a Plastic Man revival? The original was pretty cheesy as this Brave and Bold appears to be. As always I will give it a chance. I'd like to be wrong about it, but I doubt that will be the case. :smirk:

I also liked the classier nods to Adam West by way of creative voice casting from BAS and The Batman rather than what appears to be more of a cheesefest.

[Ilikemuppets]

I'm sorry but there is only ONE Batman and his name is Adam West.

DanielI've always said the same thing myself!

[wwfpooh]

Then again, I abhor the Teen Titans overly anime lookSee what you started? XD

Lots of fans of the various comic incarnations seem to notice that look right away. Me, I know that the comics inspired the series (ex: the pairing choices New Teen Titans[/U] comic line (http://titanstower.com/source/whoswho/00meeting80s.html) {Rob/Star aka Dick/Kori & BB/Terra aka Gar/Tara} and--for me, personally--a nod to the New Titans incarnation (http://titanstower.com/source/whoswho/00meetingttt3.html) {BB/Rae aka Gar/Rae, as seen in the comics that inspired the show (http://main.the-bbxrae-shrine.net/display/ShowImage?imageUrl=%2Fstorage%2Fgarxrae-comic-scans%2FMajor28.jpg&imageTitle=239849-251255-thumbnail.jpg) & in the comics based upon the show (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v294/SparkyX/TBRS%20-%20Opposites%20Attraction/Scans/Teen%20Titans%20Go/TTG42-5.jpg)}], season 2 being based on "Judas Contract" [which will have its own truer-to-comic-form movie in the future, complete with Tara/Terra being the chain-smoking, pyschotic *censored* that she was originally created to be], season 4 being based on "Terror of Trigon" [with the scene of Raven stopping her demonic daddy seemingly being a shot-for-shot representation of the same comic panel], and the series finale being a loose nod to "Terra II" [though the episode has a subtle difference in that Terra seemingly does remember her past actions--unlike in the comics where she's revived due to time travel & gets amnesia as a result--and only wants things as they currently are for both her & Garfield's sakes])--but I also realize that the show has its own merit, anime inspired look or not ([B]Note: the series is clearly American, but--like Avatar, Danny Phantom, etc.--has inspiration from Japanese animation).

[frogboy4]

(Note: the series is clearly American, but--like Avatar, Danny Phantom, etc.--has inspiration from Japanese animation).

But the Teen Titans characters spontaneously break into those stupid facial expressions for no apparent reason. That's what many non-anime-enthused animation fans object to.
It might make sense in Japanese culture, but it really doesn’t suit the Western palette unless you are a fan of Japanese animation. It is those weird asides that take me out of the story like little rude interruptions. Danny Phantom, The Batman and others don’t contain that kitschy stuff. That and the Teen Titans' theme song. Ugh. It's a running gag to those who like the history of the Teen Titans but not the current cartoon. To each their own. I find it unwatchable.

[wwfpooh]

But the Teen Titans characters spontaneously break into those stupid facial expressions for no apparent reasonI find the randomness fun. But, that's just me, apparently.

That and the Teen Titans' theme song.I find it to be enjoyable in its own unique way. That and hearing the Titans themselves (voiced by McNeville, Walsh [sp?], Payton, Strong, and Cipes) try to sing the the literal Japanese-to-English translation of their theme is downright funny, IMHO.

[Drtooth]

Again, I love animation - but the good stuff only. I never heard of a Plastic Man revival? The original was pretty cheesy as this Brave and Bold appears to be. As always I will give it a chance. I'd like to be wrong about it, but I doubt that will be the case. :smirk:

Oh yeah. There was SUPPOSED to be a Plastic Man cartoon. And there was at one point the pilot which was leaked on Youtube. It has been sinced removed.... but did you see the new Plastic Man comics from the last couple years? I forget the name of the artist, but he goes with a very cartoony, Tex Avery old school style. The animated series reflected that. And Tom Kenny was the voice of Plas... of course, they still are going with Tom Kenny as the voice actor. Which is odd since they recast everyone else.

But that's nothing. I just heard there's gonna be another Batman cartoon series. LEGO Batman....

[frogboy4]

Oh yeah. There was SUPPOSED to be a Plastic Man cartoon. And there was at one point the pilot which was leaked on Youtube. It has been sinced removed.... but did you see the new Plastic Man comics from the last couple years? I forget the name of the artist, but he goes with a very cartoony, Tex Avery old school style. The animated series reflected that. And Tom Kenny was the voice of Plas... of course, they still are going with Tom Kenny as the voice actor. Which is odd since they recast everyone else.

But that's nothing. I just heard there's gonna be another Batman cartoon series. LEGO Batman....

I think the guys behind this should have stuck to Plastic Man. It seems like the project they'd rather be doing than Batman. That's fine, but what they're doing to Bruce Wayne seems to be rolling back the progress he's made in animation for something much more campy. I like Adam West and enjoy some of his Bat antics, but have never considered him a genuine Batman. That's just my take on it. :cool:

The most interesting thing about Batman is his infamous rogues’ gallery, but this series is hardly using any of them in favor of Aquaman's ocean foes and Batman's lesser-known bad guys. While I find some of it interesting this appears to be a big mistake. Calendar Man, Cavalier, Kite Man and Zebra-Man are the four mostly exclusive Batman villains. The creators don't seem interested in the Joker, Ivy, Penguin or Catwoman.

[wwfpooh]

Perhaps this has something to do with the Bat embargo that's placed around everything starring the Caped Crusader? Maybe the embargo--in this case--makes the rouge's gallary (Jack Napier, Harvey Dent, Edward Nygma, Oswald Cobblepot, Salena Kyle, etc.) eclusive to the grittier films and TV series?

[frogboy4]

Perhaps this has something to do with the Bat embargo that's placed around everything starring the Caped Crusader? Maybe the embargo--in this case--makes the rouge's gallary (Jack Napier, Harvey Dent, Edward Nygma, Oswald Cobblepot, Salena Kyle, etc.) eclusive to the grittier films and TV series?

That hasn't been an issue in the past so I don't see why it would be one now. Also the film is so far in the future that such a thing wouldn't happen. The animated incarnations are treated as a different sort of animal. :halo:

On another note, Jack Napier was really only a Tim Burton creation (however the alias was briefly referenced on one episode of the animated series).

[wwfpooh]

That hasn't been an issue in the past so I don't see why it would be one now.The embargo is an issue at times. For instance, I believe it states that unless The Bat is the main star--or at least, one of the main stars--he can only be referenced towards (i.e. alluded to). This explains why only his shadow is seen in an episode of Teen Titans when Robin's history is being told (that is, because The Bat was not one of the stars in the show, he couldn't truly appear, due to the embargo). This same set of rules applies to the various Wonder Woman (and Wonder Girl) characters, whether they be Princess Diana, Donna Troy, or Cassie Sandsmark.

[frogboy4]

The embargo is an issue at times. For instance, I believe it states that unless The Bat is the main star--or at least, one of the main stars--he can only be referenced towards (i.e. alluded to). This explains why only his shadow is seen in an episode of Teen Titans when Robin's history is being told (that is, because The Bat was not one of the stars in the show, he couldn't truly appear, due to the embargo). This same set of rules applies to the various Wonder Woman (and Wonder Girl) characters, whether they be Princess Diana, Donna Troy, or Cassie Sandsmark.

I see where you're going but those are rights issues with DC within the animation realm in order to differentiate different cartoon projects (Teen Titans and The Batman). It has little or no bearing on the live action counterpart. I'm glad Batman and Wonder Woman don't appear in that program. I really don't like the Jap-anime-nga version of Titans.

[wwfpooh]

I'm glad Batman and Wonder Woman don't appear in that program. I really don't like the Jap-anime-nga version of Titans.Wonder Girl--Donna Troy--did an easter egg cameo though in "Homecoming Part II" within the hero line-up (as a nod to comic fans who know the history of the show & the comics that inspired it). As to The Bat, considering how The Batman has their Robin practically identical to the Titans Robin, I am pretty sure that The Batman--were he to appear in Teen Titans (which he didn't, save his shadow & a few references)--would be drawn in a similar fashion.

[Drtooth]

I see where you're going but those are rights issues with DC within the animation realm in order to differentiate different cartoon projects (Teen Titans and The Batman). It has little or no bearing on the live action counterpart. I'm glad Batman and Wonder Woman don't appear in that program. I really don't like the Jap-anime-nga version of Titans.

Let me explain, I think the problem with TT is the Japanese Anime influence off put quite a few viewers off. I think that the writing far outshines that odd quirk, but it could have done without the weird "Super Deformer" double takes (which aren't in every anime mind you). I think they could have done the same show without that stuff, and it would have been just as good. And there ARE a lot of cartoons that have anime influences... Invader Zim and the new TMNT (which even featured a shot by shot Akira scene reconstruction... brilliant!) without LOOKING exactly like them.

That said, the writing on the show made it better than it could have been. The titans all had nice chemestry with each other, and they really acted like Teenagers who happen to be superheroes. The show (Super Deformers aside) featured some great playful scenes between the group.

Unlike Legion of Superheroes. Which was that show's main problem. It wanted to be Teen Titans without being Teen Titans. The characters all seemed to not want to be there, and the playful teenagers were replaced by attitude ridden angsty teenagers. I really hoped to see a lot more playful stuff between Brainiac and Bouncing Boy... similar to Cyborg and Beast Boy in TT... but it was really slap dash, and took itself too seriously. And the playful moments even seemed grim. A good action show, IMO, is action AND comedy. I feel you can't be a true superhero without heart (Batman of course, is more of a vigilante... and there was some comedy in Batman TAS... albiet dark stuff from the Joker was most of it. But there was a playful attitude between Bruce and Alfred).

Of course, Legion didn't know what it was UNTIL second season, when they show really took off. Too bad Warners killed it before its time. but then again Legion was plagued with problems at the start. The Superboy thing comes to mind. For some stupid legal reason, they couldn't use Superboy, and had to make it Superman... but Superman is technically too young....

[frogboy4]

Let me explain, I think the problem with TT is the Japanese Anime influence off put quite a few viewers off. I think that the writing far outshines that odd quirk, but it could have done without the weird "Super Deformer" double takes (which aren't in every anime mind you). I think they could have done the same show without that stuff, and it would have been just as good. And there ARE a lot of cartoons that have anime influences... Invader Zim and the new TMNT (which even featured a shot by shot Akira scene reconstruction... brilliant!) without LOOKING exactly like them.

That said, the writing on the show made it better than it could have been. The titans all had nice chemestry with each other, and they really acted like Teenagers who happen to be superheroes. The show (Super Deformers aside) featured some great playful scenes between the group.

Unlike Legion of Superheroes. Which was that show's main problem. It wanted to be Teen Titans without being Teen Titans. The characters all seemed to not want to be there, and the playful teenagers were replaced by attitude ridden angsty teenagers. I really hoped to see a lot more playful stuff between Brainiac and Bouncing Boy... similar to Cyborg and Beast Boy in TT... but it was really slap dash, and took itself too seriously. And the playful moments even seemed grim. A good action show, IMO, is action AND comedy. I feel you can't be a true superhero without heart (Batman of course, is more of a vigilante... and there was some comedy in Batman TAS... albiet dark stuff from the Joker was most of it. But there was a playful attitude between Bruce and Alfred).

Of course, Legion didn't know what it was UNTIL second season, when they show really took off. Too bad Warners killed it before its time. but then again Legion was plagued with problems at the start. The Superboy thing comes to mind. For some stupid legal reason, they couldn't use Superboy, and had to make it Superman... but Superman is technically too young....

Super-Deformer. That's it. That's what really is odd about the show from a Western perspective and breaks me out of the world they have constructed. It just causes me to roll my eyes and give up. It's not like a specific character's quirk like they give Gir in Zim. As non-linear as that show can be I am able to enjoy it. But something like Teen Titans that has a legacy behind it should have more majesty IMHO. It's like they've made it into Cheez Wiz or that Velveeta substance. It's kind of like the real thing, but really ends up more of a cheap imitation. I do like some of the character design on Titans. Cyborg is the strongest, Beast Boy is the weakest (appearing too twink-manga influenced for my taste).

You are on-the-nose about Legion. I did like the character design, but they all appeared annoyed to be there - like they had something better to do. It could have been great. The Superboy title was also a little strange. I understand that it was another one of those technical rights issues. The whole concept of this alternate telling was a little weird, but more fans would have been willing to go with it if they writers had given the characters a better sense of camaraderie.

I suppose to me there's a Japanese-influenced animation line. Some just goes too goofy even for me. I was just reading how The Dark Knight wasn't playing as strongly in Japan! I believe it has something to do with Japanese culture being significantly harder and more rigid than it is in the Western world so many like their entertainment to be more spontaneous, escapist and less gritty. Fine classic films like The French Connection never played well over there either. I think that hits the nail on the head of it.

[Drtooth]

Super-Deformer. That's it. That's what really is odd about the show from a Western perspective and breaks me out of the world they have constructed. It just causes me to roll my eyes and give up. It's not like a specific character's quirk like they give Gir in Zim. As non-linear as that show can be I am able to enjoy it. But something like Teen Titans that has a legacy behind it should have more majesty IMHO. It's like they've made it into Cheez Wiz or that Velveeta substance. It's kind of like the real thing, but really ends up more of a cheap imitation. I do like some of the character design on Titans. Cyborg is the strongest, Beast Boy is the weakest (appearing too twink-manga influenced for my taste).

But then again, for comic book heroes I gravitate towards The Tick or the Teenage mutant Ninja Turtles, or Groo the Wanderer... And personally, I like Batman more than anyone else from DC...

Personally, what I LOVED about the Teen Titans series was the non-liniar villain fighting. It wasn't the same old... something happens, they call the heroes, they fight the villains unsuccessfully then they fight the villains again successfully plot line. Some of the best episodes of that series where them fighting the main villain in the cold opening and then having to deal with something with more depth to it later.

I think TT's main problem was they used it to do something experimental, and Super Deformers (as cute as they were in the merchandise) would be as out of place as if they did Roger Rabbit eyes popping out of their heads and jaws dropping to the floor.

Personally, what I liked was the abstact stuff like in thre Mad Mod and Larry episodes. If they used more Yellow Submarine influence and less Lucky Star (or something to that extent) it would have really popped.

[wwfpooh]

Personally, what I LOVED about the Teen Titans series was the non-liniar villain fighting. It wasn't the same old... something happens, they call the heroes, they fight the villains unsuccessfully then they fight the villains again successfully plot line.Plus, unlike her comic self, people actually would feel sorry for Terra. :p

as if they did Roger Rabbit eyes popping out of their heads and jaws dropping to the floorAnd I do believe they did do that at times. :D

The Superboy thing comes to mind. For some stupid legal reason, they couldn't use Superboy.Incidentally, in the Titan comics being produced around the same time as the show, Superboy--Conner Kent--was a regular member! :)

[Baby Gonzo]

I think it's important to remember that not every anime has the super deformed and/or random chibi moments that Teen Titans seemed to feature so heavily. It really seemed as though Teen Titans was really trying to exploit that. But it also seemed to be marketed towards a younger audience, so perhaps whoever was in charge of animation for the show must have believed it would appeal to that audience.


From what I understand (and what little I have seen) the Batman: Gotham Knights DVD features a completely anime style of Batman. Not facefaults or oversized sweatdrops.



And as far as the seriousness of Batman lately, which was mentioned earlier in the thread, I prefer the serious Batman. As much as I don't want to step on people's toes by dissing a childhood favorite of many, the live action, Adam West version of Batman from the 60s, it's just not the Batman I'm used to. Batman was originally a much darker comic than people give it credit for. There are quite a few reasons the franchise changed, but it just seemed wrong to me to see comic book covers of Superman, Batman, and Robin playing baseball. That seemed like such a dark time for comics, if you ask me. :smirk:

I remember hearing someone on TV say something along the lines of "Oh, Batman just isn't Batman without Robin there!" and "I won't go see the new movie because it doesn't have Robin." But my feelings are just the opposite. Having Robin there is mostly unneeded. Yes, he gave Batman someone to talk to, but I see more appeal in a more silent caped crusader. I'm not completely anti-Robin, but I prefer the franchise without him.

[wwfpooh]

And were they to really exist, Dick, Tim, and especially Jason would agree with you (I don't know about Stephanie or Cassie, though). XD

[frogboy4]

I think it's important to remember that not every anime has the super deformed and/or random chibi moments that Teen Titans seemed to feature so heavily. It really seemed as though Teen Titans was really trying to exploit that. But it also seemed to be marketed towards a younger audience, so perhaps whoever was in charge of animation for the show must have believed it would appeal to that audience.

From what I understand (and what little I have seen) the Batman: Gotham Knights DVD features a completely anime style of Batman. Not facefaults or oversized sweatdrops.

And as far as the seriousness of Batman lately, which was mentioned earlier in the thread, I prefer the serious Batman. As much as I don't want to step on people's toes by dissing a childhood favorite of many, the live action, Adam West version of Batman from the 60s, it's just not the Batman I'm used to. Batman was originally a much darker comic than people give it credit for. There are quite a few reasons the franchise changed, but it just seemed wrong to me to see comic book covers of Superman, Batman, and Robin playing baseball. That seemed like such a dark time for comics, if you ask me. :smirk:

I remember hearing someone on TV say something along the lines of "Oh, Batman just isn't Batman without Robin there!" and "I won't go see the new movie because it doesn't have Robin." But my feelings are just the opposite. Having Robin there is mostly unneeded. Yes, he gave Batman someone to talk to, but I see more appeal in a more silent caped crusader. I'm not completely anti-Robin, but I prefer the franchise without him.

I agree. Batman is dark (cloaked mainly by night), Superman is light (the dude is charged by the sun - can't get lighter than that). Making a joking pranking Batman just isn't right. Adam West's take, while funny, was a comedic one that reflected the trippy times. I like West, but don't think that Batman needs to ever come back in new projects. Robin...well neither Nolan nor Bale are interested in that character. Bale has insisted that he would have no part of a Batman film with the Boy Wonder. I like him okay, but he's best held back a bit. I like that The Batman introduced Batgirl first.

I have friends that like nearly all anime and manga and others that won't give any of it a chance. I was disappointed in Miyazaki's Spirited Away, but greatly enjoyed Howl's Moving Castle. Still, I prefer 24 frame animation over the 6-12 featured in his films. Nonetheless, I am willing to give most entertainment a chance. There are only a few properties where I put my foot down (the horrible Tyler Perry comedies and narcissistic Steven Seagal movies being two of them). If the story and characters look good I'm game to give it a try!

Gotham Knight was beautiful and I enjoyed much of the style. My only issue was with the lack of substance to the stories. I felt the directors should have followed the action in the fringes rather than the stories they settled on. It's something I will watch while listening to music.

Another update on the Caped Crusader. Apparently that is the working title for the third installment, but nothing has reportedly been penned yet. The Cher rumor also appears to be just that - a rumor. Depp has verbally denied being cast as the Riddler, but says it would be something of interest to him.

[Ilikemuppets]

There are only a few properties where I put my foot down (the horrible Tyler Perry comedies).I hear from the cast that the crank out like three episodes a week and rehearse right there on the set right before actually filing the show. And you know what? It shows...:p

[wwfpooh]

Can't disagree there.

[Baby Gonzo]

I agree. Batman is dark (cloaked mainly by night), Superman is light (the dude is charged by the sun - can't get lighter than that). Making a joking pranking Batman just isn't right. Adam West's take, while funny, was a comedic one that reflected the trippy times. I like West, but don't think that Batman needs to ever come back in new projects.

Well said! I agree.

[wwfpooh]

Ditto. Batman was created to be a dark character, anyhow.

[frogboy4]

I think that Adam West, however known for camp, is still very much respected in media today. The Batman honored him for four seasons as the voice of Gotham’s Mayor, Marion Grange. Batman: The Animated Series honored him as the voice of Bruce Wayne's inspiration for Batman - the Gray Ghost. The Family guy cast him as Mayor West in the series. He always cracks me up there. I also remember him in a slew of very funny advertisements before William Shatner became the cornball commercial icon he is today. I am glad West did his Batman, and I actually watched his film with my partner last month, but I feel that take already had its day and has been recorded for posterity.

I am so thankful for Nolan's Batman. Begins wasn't an easy sell for me at first. The first promotional spots had me longing for Burton's dark-pop-artsy take on the character. Nolan's take was thoughtfully crafted and interpreted from the source. The basis for his decisions thus far has had firm roots in both reality and Batman's lengthy illustrated origins. Burton’s was rooted in personal aesthetic whim. It still bugs me how he looks down on comic books when he owes much of his success to them. Nolan's Batman is Batman IMHO.

[wwfpooh]

If you had to choose, whose would it be: Burton or Nolan?

[frogboy4]

If you had to choose, whose would it be: Burton or Nolan?

In an alternate world where pizza is a health food, soda comes from water fountains and I am a film director...I would set my sites somewhere between Nolan and Burton's Batman, but more on the Nolan side. I prefer Tim Burton's playful visual style, but I like Nolan's adherence to the material, character development and grit. I would say 20% Burton 80% Nolan. :batty:

[wwfpooh]

I would agree whole-heartedly.

[Teheheman]

I know that Adam West's Batman has had his day in the sun, but Adam West was the original Batman(Not counting the original black and white ones of course) I personally think that if anything Nolan should put him in the next movie as an uncle or as the dad of a villain or something like that. Maybe even a villain, that would be unexpected. Maybe he could be a new villain who had a vendetta against his family and won't rest until they're all dead or something. Maybe I'm just crazy.

Daniel

[frogboy4]

I know that Adam West's Batman has had his day in the sun, but Adam West was the original Batman(Not counting the original black and white ones of course) I personally think that if anything Nolan should put him in the next movie as an uncle or as the dad of a villain or something like that. Maybe even a villain, that would be unexpected. Maybe he could be a new villain who had a vendetta against his family and won't rest until they're all dead or something. Maybe I'm just crazy.

Daniel

I wouldn't oppose that. I think it would be nice to at least give West a Stan Lee sort of walk-on for the next Batman picture. I still don't see West's Batman as an actual Batman. I see him more as good, fun parody. I know others may disagree. I do know Bob Kane reportedly wasn't much of a fan of that telling except for the Batmobile and the fact that the show was keeping his creation alive to some extent. But apparently there are a lot of colorful Bob Kane stories.

[wwfpooh]

Perhaps we could have the villains mock The Bat by watching a snipet of the old West show (in a reference of sorts)?

[Teheheman]

OR have him pass by a TV when they're talking about Batman and go "Eh, it's been done" and just walk away.

Daniel

[Ilikemuppets]

(Not counting the original black and white ones of course)

DanielI really love that version! Tie a damsel in distress to a train track, heh!:super:

[RedPiggy]

Perhaps we could have the villains mock The Bat by watching a snipet of the old West show (in a reference of sorts)?
Or have West be one of the Bat-wannabe's, posting funny crap on youtube....

[wwfpooh]

Or have West be one of the Bat-wannabe's, posting funny crap on youtube....That'd be even funnier!

[Drtooth]

I know that Adam West's Batman has had his day in the sun, but Adam West was the original Batman(Not counting the original black and white ones of course) I personally think that if anything Nolan should put him in the next movie as an uncle or as the dad of a villain or something like that. Maybe even a villain, that would be unexpected. Maybe he could be a new villain who had a vendetta against his family and won't rest until they're all dead or something. Maybe I'm just crazy.

Daniel


Well, he didn't technically originate the role of Batman... there were a series of theatrical serials (which are avaialable on DVD) in the 1940's. but Adam DID popularize the Batman role. The 1960's show was a way to popularize the character and it gave him the mainstream exposure that tghe comic books couldn't. And it eventually worked into multiple cartoon series... 2 from Filmation... and of course, the Super Friends. It wasn't until Burton's movie that the dark aspects of Batman were made mainstream. Then it was a main part of the franchise... especially with Batman TAS.

But then I say there are so many ways to interpret a comic book. Spider-Man can be the dark, brooding teen/20 year old that everyone hates, but still works as a superhero for a greater good... or he can be on Electric Company fighting a Yeti that likes to sit on Ice Cream.

Even Superman gets pretty dark for what it is. Batman lost his parents... Superman lost his planet. They both have some baggage there. Though I don't know exactly how Bats was portrayed in Justice League (I prefer the Bat to work alone... which is why I didn't like the fifth season on The Batman all that much- especially since the guest star took over the show, and Batman played second half the time)...

[wwfpooh]

Even Superman gets pretty dark for what it is.Such is always the way with comic heroes, man or woman. Heck, Superman's lost his planet and numerous heroes have lost their parents to dangerous circumstances, but I'd hate to be Raven, considering that her daddy literally is the Titan equivalent to Satan!

[The Count]

Well... Adam West did take a villainous turn, portraying Dr. Noah Goddard, better known as Breathtaker in the Black Scorpion series waaaaaaay back on Sci-Fi.

[Baby Gonzo]

Even Superman gets pretty dark for what it is. Batman lost his parents... Superman lost his planet. They both have some baggage there. Though I don't know exactly how Bats was portrayed in Justice League (I prefer the Bat to work alone... which is why I didn't like the fifth season on The Batman all that much- especially since the guest star took over the show, and Batman played second half the time)...

I felt that Batman being part of the Justice League worked. (At least as far as the animated series is concerned. I can't speak for the comics) Even though he was part of the team, he didn't seem so... dedicated to it. There was at least one time that the rest of the league asked him for help and he turned them down. I actually thought that some aspects of his personality came across even better there than in Batman the animated series. Overall though, I see the Justice League Unlimited (especially the Cadmus arch) to be a well writen series and I think that the way Batman comes across is thanks to the good writing.

[Drtooth]

Such is always the way with comic heroes, man or woman. Heck, Superman's lost his planet and numerous heroes have lost their parents to dangerous circumstances,

Even The light hearted The Tick had some tragic stuff in his past... let's just say, failed marriage, since his wife didn't understand his oddness....

[wwfpooh]

Me personally, I'd prefer Bruce to be alone. Yes, a certain Boy Wonder did give him a sidekick and someone to really talk to, and being in the League certainly elevated his standing (even though I prefered the original 7 to all the other added characters), but Bats is at his best when alone, honestly.

[Baby Gonzo]

I prefer Bruce on his own (and for that matter, in Gotham City) as well, but I don't think that being a part of the League hurt his character.

At least it wasn't like that Superfriends show from back in the day. :rolleyes: That gives me the shivers when I see it.

[frogboy4]

Bob Kane reportedly preferred Batman to be a loner too. I suspect Warner Brothers to continue making Batman movies even after Nolan and Bale have left. That would be when they'd bring in Robin like last time. I just don't like the idea of Robin in this telling.

[Beauregard]

I still think that Robin would work...but he'd have to go straight to Nightwinghood. He'd be like an alternate hero, like the White Knight that became Two-face. Nightwing would be like a Bat-fan who starts out alone.

[Super Scooter]

I still think that Robin would work...but he'd have to go straight to Nightwinghood. He'd be like an alternate hero, like the White Knight that became Two-face. Nightwing would be like a Bat-fan who starts out alone.

I kind of agree here. Nightwing would work in the Nolan films, but Robin wouldn't. Sadly, it would be kind of difficult to go straight into Nightwing unless you started with a very brief Robin backstory that happened in between movies.

[Drtooth]

Bob Kane reportedly preferred Batman to be a loner too. I suspect Warner Brothers to continue making Batman movies even after Nolan and Bale have left. That would be when they'd bring in Robin like last time. I just don't like the idea of Robin in this telling.


I wouldn't upset the apple cart this time, if I were Warners.... If Nolan and Bale both Bale out, they should let the Batman Franchise rest a few years and start all over with a different tone.

Look at what happened when Tim Burton and Michael Keaton left... we got a German Mr. Freeze.

[RedPiggy]

Well, he didn't technically originate the role of Batman... there were a series of theatrical serials (which are avaialable on DVD) in the 1940's. but Adam DID popularize the Batman role. The 1960's show was a way to popularize the character and it gave him the mainstream exposure that tghe comic books couldn't. And it eventually worked into multiple cartoon series... 2 from Filmation... and of course, the Super Friends. It wasn't until Burton's movie that the dark aspects of Batman were made mainstream. Then it was a main part of the franchise... especially with Batman TAS.
Don't forget multiple ScoobyDoo cameos.

[wwfpooh]

we got a German Mr. Freeze.Actually, the govern-ator is Austrian.

[greenlite]

Ok. This is what I think can work in the next movie. What do you guys think?

What we have now:


Dent & Dawes are dead, Gotham has no DA.
Jim Gordon is hunting down Batman
Joker’s still alive
Some accountant knows Batman’s identityGotham is in mourning for Dent’s death.

There’s a re-election for Gotham’s new DA

One candidate is branding himself as Dent’s successor, and he’s using “hunt down the Batman” as the election topic, thus exerting extreme pressure on Gordon.

Gordon struggles to pretend hunting Batman while fighting politicians, Gotham’s people, and his cops.

The Penguin is the other candidate (let’s use him as a smart DA rather than a chubby mayor wannabe). He has close ties with the Joker and criminals etc. Tries to take over the DA spot and control the city.

The Riddler becomes the new hero as he solves various mysteries. Then he finds out about Two-Face. Gives the info to Penguin, and destroys Gotham City’s morale.

Penguin wins the election. Releases criminals. Batman comes out and fight them.

I am not sure how to put a character into the Riddler. Like the first 2 films, the villains still carry out their “justice” with their own methods.

Possibly the Riddler works his *** off to help the police to fight criminals then finds out either nothing gets done or everyone’s corrupted (Dent turning Two-Face, Batman kills Dent). So he decides the best way is to grab total control of power to restore order.

By doing that he hunts down Penguin, Gordon, Joker, Batman, becomes the new terror in the city.

So he’s got Ra’s sense of justice and Joker’s “sending out a message” attitude.

And after he knocks down all the villains, Batman defeats him, becomes the new symbol of Gotham, restore the metal projector on the roof-top. The city is safe, and the franchise finishes with Batman on top! And no villains^^

P.S. There needs to be a tragedy as well to make the film more realistic…maybe Bruce Wayne still doesn’t have a girlfriend can be the tragedy?

[Drtooth]

I could totally see something like that.

Now, here's what I wanna know... if the Joker's around, will he be an unseen menace, like Frogboy suggested, or will he be recast? I feel the former works better, as a tribute to Heath... and if the Penguin and Riddler are also there, I feel it would be pretty cluttered with 3 villains (Since the others had around 2... Scarecrow was mentioned... don't know if that was really him)

[wwfpooh]

But with this probably being the last Nolan Batman, having more villains could work (just as it did for Spiderman).

[Baby Gonzo]

greenlite, I like your ideas, though I think I'll have a face palm moment if there is too much focus on Bruce not having a girlfriend. There are just too many angsty superheros who can't keep a girlfriend out there and it gets old after a while.

But with this probably being the last Nolan Batman, having more villains could work (just as it did for Spiderman).

Wait? Are you talking about Spiderman 3? Cause I heard alot of people say it was disappointing because there were too many villains.


I think that with good writing, it could work... But I just don't know.

[wwfpooh]

Are you talking about Spiderman 3? Cause I heard alot of people say it was disappointing because there were too many villains.[/But it still drew money & that's the focus of corporate business, for the most part. Plus, it is going to have another sequel, supposedly, whereas this third film will--in all likelihood--be Nolan's last run with The Caped Crusader.

[Redsonga]

greenlite, I like your ideas, though I think I'll have a face palm moment if there is too much focus on Bruce not having a girlfriend. There are just too many angsty superheros who can't keep a girlfriend out there and it gets old after a while.

Despite the fact that if they were real there would be a fangirl mob six feet deep wanting them *gets in line for Spider-Man, pre-Spider-Man 3*

For me it was not the villains that ruined Spider-Man 3, it was Peter himself..Honestly, it was suppose to make him truly evil, not a member of a emo rock band :coy:

[wwfpooh]

Despite the fact that if they were real there would be a fangirl mob six feet deep wanting them *gets in line for Spider-Man, pre-Spider-Man 3*That applies to a lot of fictional characters, not just superheroes, though. And it applies to fanboys with female characters, as well.

[Redsonga]

That applies to a lot of fictional characters, not just superheroes, though. And it applies to fanboys with female characters, as well.

I know, but superheros seem to have a lot more of the 'woe is me no one could love a hero/monster/geek/crazy person' storylines :coy:

[wwfpooh]

I know, but superheros seem to have a lot more of the 'woe is me no one could love a hero/monster/geek/crazy person' storylines :coy:Point taken. I think that has something to do with who writes the storyline & who edits it, as well.

[Beauregard]

Despite the fact that if they were real there would be a fangirl mob six feet deep wanting them *gets in line for Spider-Man, pre-Spider-Man 3*

Well...in Spiderman 3, he DID have a fangirl mob, but they only wanted him for superficial reasons...No one loved him the way he needed to be loved, except Mary-Jane.

I think the purpose of Venom making him more Emo than Evil...was that it would be easier for the audience to identify with the change, because it's something that we can see happen to all of our own friends when they become popular or change themselves to fit in.

I've always felt that Spiderman in particular was geared towards an emotional storyline, rather than an epic good vs evil storyline.

Bea:zany:{Personally, I'd rather turn evil than emo...or elmo...}regard

[wwfpooh]

Well...in Spiderman 3, he DID have a fangirl mobI think Beck had a specific sort of mob in mind, and not the superficial kind.

[greenlite]

I could totally see something like that.

Now, here's what I wanna know... if the Joker's around, will he be an unseen menace, like Frogboy suggested, or will he be recast? I feel the former works better, as a tribute to Heath... and if the Penguin and Riddler are also there, I feel it would be pretty cluttered with 3 villains (Since the others had around 2... Scarecrow was mentioned... don't know if that was really him)

In my imaginary movie, the closest you're gonna get with the Joker is a visit to his cell or a view of his back. I prefer him to be someone people refer to during their conversations rather than taking the centre stage...therefore really there're only two villains...I think the Joker should be retired the way the Yankees retire Babe Ruth Jersey, at least in the Nolan franchise. And you're right it's a fitting tribute for Heath too.

I think the Riddler might become an extended Harvey Dent as well cuz he's the good bad guy so you can create some sympathy for him like they did for Harvey...but Two-Face only exploded for like 10min. and the Riddler can explode for the whole movie

[greenlite]

But with this probably being the last Nolan Batman, having more villains could work (just as it did for Spiderman).

I think we might need 3+ hrs if we wanna develope a third villain (other than the Joker cuz he's not gonna appear & we already know him)...it'll end up like The Lord of the Rings, movie marathon finale. Or we might get a venom...and from what I've heard people don't really like the way he was developed...and rumors he will be in the 4th film? Cheers^^

[greenlite]

[quote=Baby Gonzo;699803]greenlite, I like your ideas, though I think I'll have a face palm moment if there is too much focus on Bruce not having a girlfriend. There are just too many angsty superheros who can't keep a girlfriend out there and it gets old after a while. quote]

I mean, the guy is getting pretty lonely he lost his gf, successor (Dent), Batmobil, not to mention his old mansion is still in the rebuiding phase ><

That's why people started talking about Catwoman & Robin etc...I don't really think the lack of female presence in the movie will hurt anyone cuz after all Holmes looked like she had Parkinson's and Gyllengeal wasn't wasn't given much to do anyway. Might as well develope more on Gordon's family since it has a mom, boy and a future batgirl (but not transforming in this one!) *could be a good rehabilitation for Christian Bale too haha.

[wwfpooh]

But for all we know, Barbra/Batgirl and Richard/Robin won't be in Nolan's films because--as noted--Nolan prefers his Bruce/Batman solo.

[greenlite]

But for all we know, Barbra/Batgirl and Richard/Robin won't be in Nolan's films because--as noted--Nolan prefers his Bruce/Batman solo.

I know and Bale will tie himself up if Robin comes along. What I meant was instead of creating another Rachael Dawes or Catwoman I prefer Nolan spending more time on family values with Gordon's "ordinary" family ie leave Robin and Batgirl for other directors who wanna take over from the 4th film

[Drtooth]

But for all we know, Barbra/Batgirl and Richard/Robin won't be in Nolan's films because--as noted--Nolan prefers his Bruce/Batman solo.

If Robin has to be in one of these Batman films, i want to see him be a 12 year old... similar to the Robin seen in The Batman, or the Kid's WB season of Batman TAS... only a LOT darker. Not Emo... more like just as serious in bringing scum to justice as Bruce would... only a lot more reckless....

Though, I'd rather NO Robin.

[wwfpooh]

If Robin has to be in one of these Batman films, i want to see him be a 12 year old... similar to the Robin seen in The Batman, or the Kid's WB season of Batman TAS... only a LOT darker.So a younger Titans Robin (in Titans, Robin was a mini-Batman, sans the brooding aspect [which he managed well when he did straddle that line]), basically?

[greenlite]

If Robin has to be in one of these Batman films, i want to see him be a 12 year old... similar to the Robin seen in The Batman, or the Kid's WB season of Batman TAS... only a LOT darker. Not Emo... more like just as serious in bringing scum to justice as Bruce would... only a lot more reckless....

Though, I'd rather NO Robin.

If that encourages kids to fight criminals rather than playing shooting games and end up shooting people in the shopping mall...then go for it^^

[Redsonga]

If that encourages kids to fight criminals rather than playing shooting games and end up shooting people in the shopping mall...then go for it^^

Hmmm..well, kids that end up shooting others usually have bigger troubles than the fact that they played shooting video games. I played DOOM since I was 12 years old and I did not grow up to be a murderer. My vote goes for the lack of understanding and help from others that the child maybe did not get that they in place of that support filled with time playing video games:sympathy:...But meh, back on topic...:)

[wwfpooh]

I played DOOM since I was 12 years old and I did not grow up to be a murderer.And many of us played that and Mortal Kombat, but we knew the difference between the visual "reality" of games and the real world.

[Drtooth]

Hmmm..well, kids that end up shooting others usually have bigger troubles than the fact that they played shooting video games. I played DOOM since I was 12 years old and I did not grow up to be a murderer. My vote goes for the lack of understanding and help from others that the child maybe did not get that they in place of that support filled with time playing video games:sympathy:...But meh, back on topic...:)

There have been older people (sometimes in their late teens, early 20's) who have acted that GTA is real... my understanding is that if you're not mature or intellegent enough to distinguish between reality and fiction, you shouldn't be exposed to any fiction. And if you're still having that conflict at an older age, you need professional help.

But back on the subject... I really see a "Batman Begins" style Robin as a younger boy who's blood thirsty for revenge (similar to Batman) after the murder of his parents, and winds u[p coming very close to getting himself killed until batman intervenes and takes him under his wing. Though, i'd prefer NO Robin.

As for Batgirl... well, if you look at the Dark Knight closely, Gordon's wife is holding 2 children closely. You only see the boy... but you just can make the girl out. She's the one that becomes Batgirl, right? Unless the next film takes place 10 years or so in the future, BatGirl wouldn't even fit in.

[wwfpooh]

my understanding is that if you're not mature or intellegent enough to distinguish between reality and fiction, you shouldn't be exposed to any fiction. And if you're still having that conflict at an older age, you need professional help.Right on the money. The problem is that because such people exist, parents complain, and so, as a result, even people who do know said difference often have to suffer because of the idiocy of some people.

[Redsonga]

Maybe it's not so much that all those people thought the games were real as it is they were just play acting like it was real and something went wrong? It happens a lot in places like colleges mixed with a lot of drinking IMHO :(

[wwfpooh]

Maybe it's not so much that all those people thought the games were real as it is they were just play acting like it was real and something went wrong?And this is where play acting goes too far (take for example, people performing pro wrestling moves on each could result in serious injury or even death).It happens a lot in places like colleges mixed with a lot of drinking IMHO :(And this is why I don't drink.

[Teheheman]

I don't drink either, but I encourage all women to drink til I look good, just don't get alcohol poisoning ;)

Daniel

[Winslow Leach]

I found this little tidbit at joblo.com, concerning director Brett Ratner (Rush Hour, Red Dragon) and the future of the franchise:

"As a kid, Batman was my thing...I'm a little jealous that I didn't get to direct it, although Nolan did a great job. But there are so many characters in the Batman series, so many characters that I love, that the opportunities for spinoffs are endless."

Ratner thinks that the first one should be a film just about the Joker, exploring his (possible) origins as the Red Hood. "That would be really cool...Heath was great...But the Joker is a great villain. That's why Jack Nicholson and Heath Ledger had so much to work with. And I think there will be another actor who can interpret that. It would be great to see Robert Downey Jr. as the Joker, for instance."

:smirk:

Okay...Ratner says there are so many characters in Batman's universe, and that "spinoffs" are endless...and he wants to start with the Joker?

Of course this is a fanboy director talking of a dream project, but still...

I'm not much of a Ratner fan. His track record:

Money Talks (with Chris Tucker and Charlie Sheen)

The Rush Hour films

The Family Man (with Nicolas Cage)

Red Dragon (the prequel to The Silence of the Lambs & Hannibal, which was already made by Michael Mann as Manhunter, but with a much smaller-name cast and budget)

X-Men: the Last Stand

Ratner is currently in production on a remake of The Incredible Shrinking Man starring Eddie Murphy. Wonder how much of Richard Matheson's novel, or the 1957 film will be retained...aside from the shrinking man, of course, lol.

[Redsonga]

*crosses fingers in direction of 3rd X-Men movie*
Good gravy, anything but a Batman movie like that, please! :(

[Winslow Leach]

Of course, Downey is a fantastic actor. I'd like to see him as a Bat villain...maybe The Mad Hatter?

[Winslow Leach]

According to imdb (I know, I know...) Ratner is slated to direct Mr. S. - My Life with Frank Sinatra, starring Chris Tucker.

This is based on the book of the same name by George Jacobs, who was Sinatra's long-time valet.

[frogboy4]

I found this little tidbit at joblo.com, concerning director Brett Ratner (Rush Hour, Red Dragon) and the future of the franchise:

"As a kid, Batman was my thing...I'm a little jealous that I didn't get to direct it, although Nolan did a great job. But there are so many characters in the Batman series, so many characters that I love, that the opportunities for spinoffs are endless."

Ratner thinks that the first one should be a film just about the Joker, exploring his (possible) origins as the Red Hood. "That would be really cool...Heath was great...But the Joker is a great villain. That's why Jack Nicholson and Heath Ledger had so much to work with. And I think there will be another actor who can interpret that. It would be great to see Robert Downey Jr. as the Joker, for instance." :smirk: Okay...Ratner says there are so many characters in Batman's universe, and that "spinoffs" are endless...and he wants to start with the Joker?

I have always thought that an Arkham Asylum movie would be ideal. You could potentially get everybody in there, but maybe just a few per movie. No actual Batman needed for that. The focus could be on the criminals and the Joker has always been the lightning rod for all of them so he'd need to be in it. There is such a video game in the works and it looks fantastic!

I don't think the fine performances from Ledger or Nicholson warrant retiring the Joker from film, but I am in favor of allowing Nolan's Joker fade from view in his pictures. There are creative ways around it, but I don’t think enough of the public would accept a recast in this telling.

One thing I am not in favor of is telling too much about the Joker's true origins. The bulk of that should always remain a mystery. Not everything needs to be spelled out in black and white for the masses. The imagination is much better than what could be devised by any screenwriter. As much as I enjoyed Hannibal Rising, not even the book's author could provide a backstory worthy of such a frightening legacy - and he did come up with some creepy stuff!

[Winslow Leach]

I don't think the fine performances from Ledger or Nicholson warrant retiring the Joker from film, but I am in favor of allowing Nolan's Joker fade from view in his pictures. There are creative ways around it, but I don’t think enough of the public would accept a recast in this telling.



Oh, I'm fine with the Joker eventually returning in another film sometime down the line...I was surprised that Ratner, supposedly a true Bat-fan, would start "his" franchise with such a familiar, recognizable and iconic character. Especially after Heath Ledger's astounding performance. Batman's rogues gallery is rich with villains...why not start with someone who hasn't appeared yet?

I always thought Crispin Glover would make an excellent Joker myself, but after seeing TDK, it's hard to imagine anyone else in the role (for now anyway) but Heath Ledger.

I agree that origin stories aren't always necessary. I liked that we didn't know much (if anything) about the Joker's true origins in Nolan's film, and how he would change his story every time he asked, "wanna know how I got these scars?"

As for Hannibal Rising, it was a good read and a pretty good film, but Thomas Harris didn't really need to tell us how and why Lecter became Lecter.

[MrsPepper]

Of course this is a fanboy director talking of a dream project, but still...

I'm not much of a Ratner fan. His track record:

Money Talks (with Chris Tucker and Charlie Sheen)

The Rush Hour films

The Family Man (with Nicolas Cage)

Red Dragon (the prequel to The Silence of the Lambs & Hannibal, which was already made by Michael Mann as Manhunter, but with a much smaller-name cast and budget)

X-Men: the Last Stand

Ratner is currently in production on a remake of The Incredible Shrinking Man starring Eddie Murphy. Wonder how much of Richard Matheson's novel, or the 1957 film will be retained...aside from the shrinking man, of course, lol.

Um, can we keep this guy away from Batman, please? He already destroyed X-Men for me.

(The things in bold are what made me think to myself, "Wow, what a bad idea!" For the record I like The Family Man... but Batman is NOT a Family man! >_<)

[Drtooth]

Ratner is currently in production on a remake of The Incredible Shrinking Man starring Eddie Murphy. Wonder how much of Richard Matheson's novel, or the 1957 film will be retained...aside from the shrinking man, of course, lol.

Oh no! No no no no no! No way! Uh Uh!

Personally, unless Nolan really really really wants to do another Batman after the Caped Crusader (or even the Caped Crusader itself), I think we should put the character away for a little while and focus on something else. We're gonna wind up with someone either doing their own thing out of step with Nolan, or someone trying hard to be Nolan, but not being able to measure up...

If there's one thing I don't wanna see is a Batman and Robin style camp fest trying to continue the story line of Batman Begins.

[frogboy4]

Ratner's X-Men film didn't bother me as much as it did others. It really should have been done correctly and as two films. That way the Pheonix personas could have adequately been separated and more complex plot points wouldn't have needed to be slapped together. That way it would have been more satisfying to core fans while giving moviegoers another flashy X-movie.

Ratner has stated that he’d have rather helmed Singer’s Superman movie. I don’t know why that gets such bad press. It turned a profit internationally, but it was just so needlessly expensive and long. A sharper focus, tighter budget and shorter running time would have saved Singer’s Superman a lot of grief. We’d likely be awaiting the sequel to it by now if not for all the time spent referencing the Reeve films. Ratner says he would have focused on the life and politics of Krypton. Interesting, but not necessarily super enough for the character’s return. I’m still concerned over the Man of Steel sequel vs. the total reboot trilogy idea. I’m just glad the Justice League film was nixed. That could have put all the DC characters in limbo for a long time.

I do think that comics/graphic novels have the distinct opportunity to follow vastly different tellings of the same characters while maintaining strong brand identity in a way that film cannot. I do think there's enough juice to at least explore Arkham while this other stuff is going on as long as the Bat doesn't make an official appearance. Maybe that's where they could stick Robin! Maybe Batgirl too. But definitely Harley Quinn! :flirt:

[ryhoyarbie]

If there's one thing I don't wanna see is a Batman and Robin style camp fest trying to continue the story line of Batman Begins.

Wait! You did not like the beginning of Batman and Robin where they're putting on their suits and the camera is showing their behinds? :confused::eek:

























Okay, I didn't either.......

[Fozzie Bear]

I've been pegged to play the role of Poison Ivy in the next Batman movie!

Of course not, but it's all interesting news and I can't wait to see where they take the film next time. I thing The Dark Knight is going to be HARD to top. Sadly, Heath Ledger is the ONLY person who ever got the character of The Joker right!

I'm very interested to see where Nolan takes the Bat next, because I've been uber impressed with his work so far!

[Drtooth]

Ratner's X-Men film didn't bother me as much as it did others. It really should have been done correctly and as two films. That way the Pheonix personas could have adequately been separated and more complex plot points wouldn't have needed to be slapped together. That way it would have been more satisfying to core fans while giving moviegoers another flashy X-movie.

Maybe it's because I caught them on television, but the 2 X-Men movies I saw didn't leave an impression on me at all. It's not that they were bad, but just not as good as the hype set it up to be.
I’m just glad the Justice League film was nixed. That could have put all the DC characters in limbo for a long time.

A Justice League movie would be all sorts of corny. I think if Paul Dini wrote the script, and they worked closely with others who worked on the cartoon series, it may warrent fans to go see it... but the only was a JLA movie will really make money is if they directly animate it and release it theatrically.

[frogboy4]

Maybe it's because I caught them on television, but the 2 X-Men movies I saw didn't leave an impression on me at all. It's not that they were bad, but just not as good as the hype set it up to be.

A Justice League movie would be all sorts of corny. I think if Paul Dini wrote the script, and they worked closely with others who worked on the cartoon series, it may warrent fans to go see it... but the only was a JLA movie will really make money is if they directly animate it and release it theatrically.

The X-Men fims are actually really good. The first one is too short to really get things going, the second one is a lot of movie that's maybe a beat or two too long, and the third one tries to jam too much into it that character motivations and continuity miss the mark. Seeing any of those films edited for the small screen and jammed between ads for zit cream and soda pop does not do any of them justice. Singer actually directed the first two. The direction they are going in now with the individual character films is probably the way to go. So is the new cartoon. Has anyone seen the trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45JfiaidkhE) for it? Wow! It's not a DVDtoon it's an actual series!

Anyway, I digress. It appears that Johnny Depp is already pegged to be Tim Burton's Mad Hatter in his live action & CGI version of Alice in Wonderland. I don't think that would conflict with any Batman schedule as it appears that will take some time for momentum. I doubt that we'll hear much until around or after the Oscar season. I still hope Depp is cast as the Riddler.

[Winslow Leach]

Anyway, I digress. It appears that Johnny Depp is already pegged to be Tim Burton's Mad Hatter in his live action & CGI version of Alice in Wonderland. I don't think that would conflict with any Batman schedule as it appears that will take some time for momentum. I doubt that we'll hear much until around or after the Oscar season. I still hope Depp is cast as the Riddler.

Depp certainly has a full plate ahead of him.

He signed on for three Disney films: Alice in Wonderland, Pirates of the Carribean 4 and The Lone Ranger, which will be produced by Jerry Bruckheimer. But Depp isn't playing the Ranger. He's actually been cast as the Ranger's sidekick, Tonto.

There's also a rumor that Tim Burton wants to direct an adaptation of the 1960s gothic soap opera Dark Shadows, with Depp as vampire Barnabas Collins.

I'm really looking forward to Michael Mann's Public Enemies, based on the excellent non-fiction book by Bryan Burrough. The book chronicles the crime spree in the early 1930s, in which John Dillinger, Baby Face Nelson, Pretty Boy Floyd, Bonnie and Clyde, Machine Gun Kelly and the Barker Gang all rose to infamy, and gave birth to the modern FBI, headed by J. Edgar Hoover.

Depp is Dillinger, Billy Crudup is Hoover, Channing Tatum is Pretty Boy Floyd, and Christian Bale is Melvin Purvis, Hoover's #1 crime-busting golden boy.

Then there's The Rum Diary, based on Hunter S. Thompson's 1959 novel. This film has been rumored for years, with Depp playing Thompson. Of course, he already played the good doctor in Terry Gilliam's faithful adaptation of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, in which Depp did a spot-on portrayal of Thompson (or rather his alter ego, Raoul Duke). The film co-starred Benicio Del Toro as Duke's attorney, "Dr. Gonzo," and Del Toro is rumored to direct The Rum Diary.

Hopefully in between all this, Depp will sign on as The Riddler, if indeed Mr. Nygma is to appear in the next Batman film...

[Ilikemuppets]

Oh wow-oh wow! The new X-Men cartoon looks so purrrrrddy! It's so shiny... *Drools vehemently*:insatiable:

[Drtooth]

The direction they are going in now with the individual character films is probably the way to go. So is the new cartoon. Has anyone seen the trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45JfiaidkhE) for it? Wow! It's not a DVDtoon it's an actual series!

It looks good, but I doubt it will last long. Considering how it's been shoved into an obscure cable channel that only a 3rd of cable providers give... and also considering the Spectacular Spider-Man is all but canceled, and the second season hasn't even started yet.

[frogboy4]

It looks good, but I doubt it will last long. Considering how it's been shoved into an obscure cable channel that only a 3rd of cable providers give... and also considering the Spectacular Spider-Man is all but canceled, and the second season hasn't even started yet.

This animated series is allowed to be darker and more stylized than ever before. I think Sci Fi should have picked it up. The production value shows and is a big part of its selling-point. It could also be too expensive for other networks. :sympathy:

[Drtooth]

This animated series is allowed to be darker and more stylized than ever before. I think Sci Fi should have picked it up. The production value shows and is a big part of its selling-point. It could also be too expensive for other networks. :sympathy:

I think 4Kids should have had first dibs on Spider-Man season 2.... and then talk about the rest of these projects. It's a real shame Saturday mornings are all but dead, and the greedy relatives are waiting to pull the plug so they can get it's vast fortune of time to run infomercials in... otherwise, these shows would actually have a place. I like the direction of this new X-Men show... though I still don't like the little Emo version of Rogue from the movies (Call me a purist, but I miss her being the tough southern belle sort).

[Ilikemuppets]

(Call me a purist, but I miss her being the tough southern belle sort).Would have to agree. Really liked that version of her much better.

[frogboy4]

I think 4Kids should have had first dibs on Spider-Man season 2.... and then talk about the rest of these projects. It's a real shame Saturday mornings are all but dead, and the greedy relatives are waiting to pull the plug so they can get it's vast fortune of time to run infomercials in... otherwise, these shows would actually have a place. I like the direction of this new X-Men show... though I still don't like the little Emo version of Rogue from the movies (Call me a purist, but I miss her being the tough southern belle sort).

You're right. I think she could be both. That could be interesting.

With the exception of The Batman I haven't been an active Saturday morning viewer. The problem with this cancellation and void of such quality animated television programs is due to the fact that there's no strong leadership to shepherd them. I would love to see a totally Adult Swim sort of animation network that focused on the teen to adult market. There is a desire out there, but much of the product is axed or eaten up on the web.

[Drtooth]

With the exception of The Batman I haven't been an active Saturday morning viewer. The problem with this cancellation and void of such quality animated television programs is due to the fact that there's no strong leadership to shepherd them. I would love to see a totally Adult Swim sort of animation network that focused on the teen to adult market. There is a desire out there, but much of the product is axed or eaten up on the web.

I've been whining about that for the past year and a half. It's all due to the FCC and all these stupid rules and regulations that make children's programming unprofitable. Throw the internet, video games and shows about singers who can neither sing nor act, and you got the perfect storm for the death of animation. Kid's WB certainly didn't try very hard the past 2 years (Warners was only responsible for 3 shows out of 8 for example) and they recently said, heck with it and sold the line up to their competition.

I feel the Batman had a strong push behind it... if it didn't it would have been canceled after the second season (like most of WB's latest projects). Though I still say it really deserved a 6th season or mini season or something, coming off the heals of Dark Knight. The last season seemed a wash in JLA team ups that were hit or miss, instead of the bolder version they had in season 4, which is really when the show hit it's stride, and became more than what it was at the beginning. And it more than made up for the cliches and corniness of season 3... including the episode where Bushroot...errr...Poison Ivy turned everyone into plant zombies. A plot line that could have easily fit in with Super Friends or the 1970's Batman cartoon.